Clay

I know who RBW64 is and he is a stand up guy that is a pleasure to race with and he is entitled to his opinion. I happen to think the nay-sayers are correct on this one. Charging a premimum to be the first in line is counter to the concept of this class. Spread that extra 50K over the first 100 kits and have a lottery.

Hey Lee - I respect his opinion (and everyones) and happen to disagree with it - and the Ayn Rand & Mitt response was tongue in cheek.

Lee Spuhler wrote:Clay
Charging a premimum to be the first in line is counter to the concept of this class. Spread that extra 50K over the first 100 kits and have a lottery.

I'm not sure I understand your proposal. Is the idea (1) that people agree to pay an extra $500 to enter a drawing for one of the first hundred kits or is it (2) the drawing for kit order is totally random across all buyers and if your name happens to be one of the first hundred drawn you pay an extra $500?

Option (1) doesn't seem all that different from the system proposed by Enterprises. It just happens to lower the price of entering the lottery. People are still paying up to be an early recipient, there just paying a little less.

Option (2) seems flawed from the perspective that the price you are expected to pay is random. What do you do with someone who draws a slot in the top 100 but doesn't want to pay the extra $500?

Maybe Erik should have avoided all this hassle and just priced the kit at $11,995? Fewer kits would likely be sold, but that's the breaks.

Hey, let's make it a "silent auction" that way we can see the real "market" price for being an "early adopter".

What'd I'd like to see is a full price list, including "mandatory" options (e.g. Alternator) and non-mandatory options (data acquisition?). Hopefully we will have access to ECU data acquisition that is supported by all the major suppliers (e.g. AIM). All that will impact the true value of "buying" a place in line (I assume only the top category will have any chance).

I think Peter's fist post pretty much nailed it.
I am with Eric on this. The First 25 fee is OK with me. There was a cost to develope all this and if the first twenty five want to help defray that by being first then have at it. I am happy to be racing in this class with the single supplier concept. Besides this only affects those 25 anyway. I can count at least that many SRF owners who spend more that 2000 on a weekend not "on track " related.

Well, I am now equipped with a keyboard, vs. tapping on a phone in an
airport waiting area, so I will take another run at this with a bit more
depth. And yes, I know the Runoffs are being held now, which limits the
audience. Accidental? Anyhow...

Those motivated to respond (a few, not too many) to my original post are
split nearly 50-50. If this is true for the nearly 1,000 SRF owners at
large, it's likely a dead issue. Nevertheless, I am an optimist, so let's
take a deeper look at some of the issues raised.

1- If Enterprises can make $50k off rich idiots, why should we stop
them? That's how the world works anyhow, who are we to fight it?

Enterprises deserves, and needs, to be profitable. I think we all (or nearly
all) know that. However, I do not recall hearing that Enterprises is in dire
need of $50k to stay afloat. And, if it is, there are more sensible
solutions than selling air to those willing to pay for it. A $100 bump to
the engine price would eventually add about $100k to the coffers, would hurt
no one excessively, and hit everyone equally.

Sure, money makes the world go 'round, at least here, today. But I thought
that SRF was designed as a way to fight back against that, wasn't it? Why
would we decide that we want a class where money matters as little as
possible and then "sell" priority access to the newest equipment? (Why did I
leave GT?) I still haven't seen any assurance that the supply will meet the
demand by the time the cars can go on track, so let's admit that what's
really being sold is additional time to test and tune with the new engine.
Should that go to the well- (or relatively better) heeled?

2 - Aw, Erik's a good guy, and he limited the maximum bid to $2,000 anyway,
so what's the harm? How about a silent auction to set the "real" price?

I know Erik, I like Erik, Erik's a good guy, Erik just blew this particular
call. It happens. He's not quite perfect, just ask him.

It's not the selling of slots once one has already acquired it that bothers
me (That's for you, Mittster fans, but why would millionaires muck about SRF
rather than playing with Peterson?) but rather I object to the entire idea
of selling the slots by Enterprises. That's what sellers do if you want to
buy a jet, or the latest and greatest limited edition 'Vette, 'Stang, etc.,
but doing so has consequences. I don't think Erik wants to choose car
dealers as his target reputation. Selling priority access may be accepted at
Disneyland or at airlines, but let's keep it out of our little piece of the
racing world.

The idea of an uncapped auction is, I think, a great way to make my point.
If someone offered $100k to be first, or the first 25 bids were $10k each,
how would that fly? I bet no one wants to see that. Why did Erik use a $2k
cap? Because he couldn't possibly justify, to us or to himself, the pure
greed that it implies.

Here's the problem folks. This issue is like the girl whose date took her to
see "Pretty Woman" and when Redford made his proposal whispered. "For that
much, I'd do him." When her date said "How a about a quickie for $10 right
now?" she answered huffily, "What kind of girl do you think I am?" to which
the reply was, "We've already established that, now we're negotiating the
price."

The problem is that once you sell your honor, you can't get it back. Once
everyone signs on to the "Well, what's the harm, let Enterprises make a few
bucks that don't hurt me, and I don't have to pay," the next time anything
is priced, what questions might you think of. Here are some that come to
mind. What's the kickback (from the price we all pay) to Enterprises from
_________ (fill in the blank, the chosen tire supplier, the chosen
alternative seat supplier, the shock supplier, the wheel supplier, etc,
etc.) To retain the full faith and confidence of our community it is
important that Enterprises acts so that we are sure we are all being treated
fairly and honestly, straight up and above board, keeping the purity of
Caesar's wife.

If you agree, tell Erik right now, before it's too late. eskirmants@scca.com

PS, when I signed up, I was asked to choose a pseudonym. I assumed that this
was part of the forum mores. I have no need for, nor interest in, hiding my
ID from anyone-- I am R.B. (Bruce) Wright, SRF #64, SCCA Mem. #212. RBW64
seemed logical.

Bruce - I understand your concerns and I think this is a one time situation that helps the economics of our class. Except you mixed up Pretty Woman and Indecent Proposal. I think there are 8-10 guys in our division who would pay a $5,000 bump to get one of the first 25 cars - and they aren't even in the oil business - I am but that is over my budget restraints.

claysylvester wrote:Bruce - I understand your concerns and I think this is a one time situation that helps the economics of our class. Except you mixed up Pretty Woman and Indecent Proposal. I think there are 8-10 guys in our division who would pay a $5,000 bump to get one of the first 25 cars - and they aren't even in the oil business - I am but that is over my budget restraints.

No need to bring facts and economic logic into this when Bruce is on a roll. I'm sure we all would be happy to pay an extra $100 per kit to satisfy his definition of fairness.

As a "customer", I see no customer benefit in the long term with this program. It wasn't necessary to get the Ford program started; it's not necessary now. As was the case with the Ford, I expect $10,499 (whatever the starting price) to start escalating as the real costs surface (never mind the possible side effect on Enterprise margins if these engines last longer than the Ford and the rebuild "cash cow" disappears.) Playing "financial favoritism" is a slippery slope and a bad precedent.

The way I look at it is the new kits will be coming in the next 6 month (?) when I am still racing the old 1.9 Ford so I wouldn't be converting anyway until about this time next fall. Maybe Enterprise can use the extra money for a loyalty bonus for the under paid staff that are there because they love, not because they want to get rich. I know they’re not getting rich on my extravagant spending habits. With my $0 down commitment, I’ll probably be looking at the box sitting in the garage for a few months before I get to it because I’ll still be racing the current version.