conversion tips

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 08, 2014 8:04 am
Having finished a GEN3 conversion I thought a thread with tips/tricks/mistakes might help future conversions go more smoothly. Sharing our experiences may help us to not repeat mistakes.

Some things I learned.... Be sure the cross members that go below the oil pan are not bent up. The clearance is more critical than on the 1.9 ...... Don't assume the drilled locations for the motor mounts while OK for the 1.9 will work for the Gen3. The hole on the head mounting bracket was 3/4" too high on mine. .... If the shifter shaft is in contact with the pan, you can use a torch and adjust it while installed. .... Do something to cover the hole in the bell housing where the slave used to
attach. Perkins puts the boot back on somehow. It is VERY easy to drop a bolt in the hole, and VERY hard to fish it out.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 08, 2014 1:34 pm
Thanks Tom,

There is probably a nicer way to capture it...but what the heck, I can do this NOW rather than spend another week thinking about it:

I will be reposting the latest manual next week. Most of these types of items can go in there.

If you have kits 1-24 we started machining two small areas on the engine block under where the starter adapter / starter bolts up...yours isn't done. If you don't know what I am talking about, send us a note for a reference picture. All engines have this done, since #24, and all have been turned over by the starter delivered on the engine before shipping since about #28. (We are not adding things that are not long term items to the manual).

Please really read Mike's section on the clutch, over traveling the slave cylinder is a very bad thing to do. Do be very thorough on building your clutch lines. We are going to get some pre-made lines, and will accept a swap (of untouched parts) in the Fall...I will not stop the presses to do this right this second. If you cannot build the lines yourself comfortably, find a racing buddy who has built some.

I will add more...lots of discussions about wire lengths and in fairness to Mike he had a manual update weeks ago, but I was waiting for a few consolidations. The unique links I am using now will go away and we will have a standard link, that we just repost to on our website soon.
Erik
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 12:30 pm
In this time of quick updates many little decisions do arise, while simultaneously we have people installing kits. We will do what we have always done, "the right thing" if someone gets caught out.

One example: I was holding off on announcing a decision, while seeing if it is feasible, that we want the airbox to never be cut. Requiring all fitment to be done to the center section...it looks probable; but anytime you mate up to the bodywork some cases are easier than others. If you have already cut the airbox, which is a non-performance issue (as mentioned in a Spec Racer News - it's non-sealed, non-pressurized and a fresh air intake only) I envision placing a compliance sticker on the lid of your airbox to identify compliance as is. Alternatively you can buy one, once supply is completely caught up, for our cost. If it ends up being just one or two we can supply them.

These things will happen...it's still a sprint right now. But there are signs that we can return to the marathon (my specialty) soon.
Erik
SCCA Enterprises

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 31, 2014 9:18 pm
Be sure the cross members that go below the oil pan are not bent up.

For what it's worth, I checked and rechecked my cross member and found it to be straight with no bends. Upon bolting together the engine and transmission, I did not have clearance for the oil pan. Do yourself a favor and bend it down a 1/4 inch or more before you have the engine and transmission bolted together. it's a lot easier bending without having the engine in the way!!

Novice Typer
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 01, 2014 5:06 pm
After spending LOTS, LOTS, of time measuring, lowering and removing the 1.6......again LOTS of time....if you don't have .5 inches of clearance with your 1.9, you will likely have a clearance issue.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 9:18 pm
Has anyone been able to get the intake manifold back on with locating studs in place and the seat belt ladder installed? Not saying I couldn't, but I decided to remove the locating studs before I broke something. Of course now I'm missing one of the expensive looking o-ring on the injectors. Time to get the spot light out and start rolling around on the garage floor!
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 4:51 pm
We had a number for the bolt height above the frame rail for the front engine mount bracket, 1.625". That is what a new chassis is, or higher... Mike says 1.75" can be better. If your mount is low (sorry to say that some folks did that on purpose back in the day) you won't clear the frame diagonal. However, that isn't the only factor, so it has been a discussion on about 25% of the conversions regardless of the mount hole height.

Regarding the intake; I made a huge deal with the R&D folks and CSR's about how hard it was to get it on the engine in the car ...I set the tone as nearly impossible...we even give you the gearwrench to get your two clicks at a time on a couple fasteners. (I could bore you for an hour with why the intake is exactly what it is and how hard we worked with the supplier to get what we have). Maybe because I made such a big deal with those folks my first dozen or so comments back were..."what was the problem Erik"...mission accomplished. But there is no room to play with, some seat belt ladder covers will need help to give you room to swing the intake down. Those studs are an important alignment tool so you rotate the intake into place, and not slide it and ruin those o rings. Also, as with the topic in the previous paragraph, we cannot control prior workmanship on mounts. The 1.9L rattled around in that hole compared to the dressed 1.6L (engine is smaller, accessories are larger). Bill, no one else had to remove the studs...we need to look for what is different with your car.

Thanks for posting! Nothing anyone experiences will be a one off issue...even if we find a problem with a car; there will be another one with the same issue. We do hope to minimize frustration. Input from our most experienced community members indicates that Mike Davies has us leagues ahead of the original Renault kits and the Roush Ford conversion...but we knew we would exceed those benchmarks.
Erik
SCCA Enterprises

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 6:24 pm
Thanks for starting up this conversation (Tom and Bill). I am pulling my engine weekend after next and getting my Gen3 the last week in September. I have read the manual through (twice), but these posts are really helping me think about issues to prepare for.

Keep it up and I will do the same.

DaveP

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 08, 2014 9:18 am
Warning-Test fit plug for crank sensor and mark orientation on the crank sensor before engine install. Once you install the engine you can just barely see about 1/3 of the crank sensor and with fat hands it’s hard to connect the plug to the sensor. Once it snaps on it will be next to impossible to get it off again with the engine in the frame unless you know something I don’t. I had to tap it on with a screw driver blade because I could not get a good angle on it, so having it orientated properly the first time is important.
Take the injector rail off the intake manifold for easier installation. Once I did that the manifold just barely got on the bolts without worrying about the injectors. If you have a shoulder harness ladder rail like I do, it makes the install go a lot easier. I did have to grind off about .05” of the exterior upper to lower mating flange on the manifold to get clearance so that the manifold was not rubbing the ladder. I’m not sure if that’s enough clearance to avoided contact when the engine is rocking in the rubber mounts, we'll see.
Also, I did check the center high on my engine mount and it was lower than what Erik quoted, so that would account for the oil pan hitting the cross member brace. Now that I have the brace bent and the motor installed does mean that I could run a muck in terms of compliance rules?
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 08, 2014 3:32 pm
Bill Parenteau wrote:Warning-Test fit plug for crank sensor and mark orientation on the crank sensor before engine install. Once you install the engine you can just barely see about 1/3 of the crank sensor and with fat hands it’s hard to connect the plug to the sensor. Once it snaps on it will be next to impossible to get it off again with the engine in the frame unless you know something I don’t. I had to tap it on with a screw driver blade because I could not get a good angle on it, so having it orientated properly the first time is important.


Just a thought -- maybe offer a pig tail connector that comes off the crank sensor terminal that can reach out into an area where it can be more easily accessed?
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