AIM -vs- CDS

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 12:26 pm
Looking for suggestions of what data system to go with (if any) for my G3 conversion...

I have not been a "data" guy in the past, but everyone tells me I should get it.

Typically I look at my analog gauges (temp/AF/voltage) on straits,
and my Trackmate for best lap, and + or - lap times out of the corners.
I borrowed an AIMsolo lap timer for the Runoffs and liked how simple it was to set up and read the info on the display. Very helpful, very simple. Made me faster.

If I get a data system I'd like something that will replace my analog gauges, is user friendly, I can build on over time and will lay data over video. No beacons. No batteries.
Also on the list is a huge warning light that you can't miss if bad things are happening to the motor!
Shut it down! Shut it down NOW! ha...

I looked at both their websites and they both look complicated and the video integration didn't seem so great on either of them.

If I get one or the other, this is what I'm thinking will be the benefit:
Monitor the performance/health of the vehicle.
Improve my race technique.
Reduce trial and error testing to speed up improvements.
Store data for archiving and comparison with other drivers.

I know this topic has been posted in other threads but could not find the answers I'm looking for.

Any and all input appreciated!

Thanks...
Robert Reed
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 3:00 pm
My general recommendation is to invest in a system where there's an opportunity to share data. Different parts of the country tend to favor different systems. That said, I've had an AIM MXL system for a long time and have replaced all the gauges in my SRF, investing in additional sensors and technologies (e.g. GPS, AF, etc.) over time. With my conversion to the Gen 3, most of my sensor readings are now coming from the Gen 3 ECU. This was effectively "plug-and-play" with the CAN-Bus interface, plus reconfiguration of the dash to match to the new sensor names and settings (all of which are pre-packaged in the ECU configuration for all available sensors.)

There are basically three options today, each varying by price and features. At the low end of the scale, there's the combination of the G-Dash and EVO-4, which will give you most of what the others provide in a small, basic display. This will give you everything on your list except video overlay and external warning light (though there are configurable warning lights on the dash itself.) This is about $1,400 for GPS, CAN-BUS interface, and Lat-G built it. There a lot of expansion capability if you want to add other sensors in the future. It's also small enough to be steering wheel mounted.

While the MXL is still being sold, the MXL2 is a better deal. I've seen it in an SRF and it's very similar in layout and form factor. The display looks a bit brighter than the MXL. For a similar base configuration to the G-Dash/EVO4, your talking about $2,000.

Next up is the new MXS. This is a multi-color configurable display. The pictures looks good, but I haven't seen one in action to provide feedback (one of our West Coast drivers ran one at Daytona and look forward to his feedback) on the quality/brightness of the display. Starting price is around $2,300.

A couple of nice features of the MXL2 and XMS are that the alarms can be solid or set to a configurable blinking frequency, and an optional text message displayed. There are also two digital outputs that could drive external signals (e.g. big bright warning light) based on any sensor value (e.g. standard warning light at 220 degrees and external alarm at 240 degrees). Both of these also use the RaceStudio3 software (still a work in progress, though). One feature advertised (wireless connectivity) is still not available (to the best of my knowledge) but I expect to see in a future software release.

For Video, there's the SmartyCAM HD/GP add-on to any of the above This records HD video with any of the sensor readings. An example on this site is the video posted by Bob Gardner recently of his run at the Daytona Runoffs. This will run an additional $1,000-$1,100 depending on model. There are also some 3rd party software tools that can post-process a video file with the AIM data, though it does seems to take a bit of work (an no instant gratification!)

http://www.aim-sportline.com is the best source of technical information. If you want to get some idea of component pricing and options, I'd highly recommend the Ferguson's (Dave and Ellen) web site at http://veracitydata.com. They also sell CDS and could offer additional insight into your needs. They've been very supportive in getting the AIM systems ready for the Gen 3, including building out "plug-and-play" cables for the CAN-BUS connections. Great support as well...
Bob Breton - SRF 51 - San Francisco Region

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 7:07 pm
-vs. TraqMate vs. Race Technologies. Many people using these in this area. ECU input into Race Tech has been problematic because company support is virtually non-existent, but the system supports syncing to a GoPro with or without the ECU connection.qqq

What parameter are you looking for to indicate if your engine is going south? I bought a very bright red LED from superbrightleds.com for the alternator light, $5, that lights up if the belt breaks. Also got a Longacre low oil pressure switch for around $30 and hooked that up to another bright red LED. Engine parameters can be downloaded directly from the ECU post-race using free software, if you want to look at oil pressure vs. Lat. g's for example. For sure, not as pretty as any of the $$$ systems (which you will need to learn!), but for me it's satisfactory and more reliable than digital systems.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 3:54 pm
I really like my Traqmate with the Traqdash graphical touch screen display mounted on my steering wheel. I like getting clear, easily readable basic performance data at a glance, or even a slight peek, and the Traqdash's well designed display delivers. It's also insanely easy to configure.

It doesn't have a CAN data input, which is okay for me as I still use mechanical oil pressure and water temp gauges. It does have two alarm lights that can be configured to trigger off its two analog channel inputs. I have an alarm set for low voltage.

Rob, I believe you already have the Traqmate basic system, which can be easily upgraded to the Traqdash for $599. If you want to add its 1080p video camera and its associated electronics box, that'll run you another $365. Optional WiFi data upload connectivity is $128. (Of course, you can access data files via the SD card or USB.)

Oh, and I forgot -- it also has an optional Bump Drafting Sensor that displays closing rate data, bumper contact alarm, etc. Very cool. (And very fictional.)
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 4:03 pm
Bob Devol wrote: Oh, and I forgot -- it also has an optional Bump Drafting Sensor that displays closing rate data, bumper contact alarm, etc. Very cool. (And very fictional.)


It's called "Traqmate Love Tap add-on". It's greatness.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 9:42 pm
Racer X wrote:
Bob Devol wrote: Oh, and I forgot -- it also has an optional Bump Drafting Sensor that displays closing rate data, bumper contact alarm, etc. Very cool. (And very fictional.)


It's called "Traqmate Love Tap add-on". It's greatness.


Bump.

(See what I did there?)
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2015 10:42 am
Awesome! Thanks everyone!

I appreciate all the input.
Lots of research still to do...
Robert Reed
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 23, 2015 9:20 pm
One warning you may want to keep in mind is an alarm for loss of the water pump belt.

You might also look at what the fast guys in Spec Racer are running, if you're intending to dig deep and really use your data to improve your overall performance. Call Mike Davies at Enterprises and get his input, too - he knows who is running what, and which ones really give the best results.

One thing that a lot of systems do not focus on is the driver input and how it compares to the car's response. In order to do serious analysis on the car's handing, you need to have sensors for throttle, steering, and brake pressures - in that order of importance.

Here's a link to the CDS approach to analyzing a car's handling:

http://www.competitiondata.com/download ... ng_wiz.htm

Another thing to look for is real-time feedback while you're on-track. Some data systems give you a predictive lap time. While this is helpful, what is more useful is a sector performance tool that tells you whether the last corner you took was faster or slower than your best time. Being able to immediately see whether a different line improved the time through a given track segment can help you make better use of a test session - and we never have enough track time, so anything that gets us information faster is worth having.

Here is a link to both a really good Sportscar article and some links that might be helpful in seeing what data logging can and should be used for in racing:

http://www.competitiondata.com/download ... rticle.pdf
http://www.competitiondata.com/cgi-bin/ ... 1297259450

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